Reclaim You- Navigating ADHD and Eating Disorder Recovery
Like, follow and leave us a comment on YouTube, Apple Podcasts or Spotify!
In this conversation, Sarah and Eva Haldis, owner of Reclaim Nutrition, discuss the intersection of nutrition and ADHD, particularly in relation to eating disorders.
Eva shares her personal journey with ADHD and how it has influenced her understanding of her clients' experiences.
They explore the impact of medication on appetite and discuss strategies for nourishing the body consistently. The conversation highlights the importance of understanding the unique challenges faced by individuals with ADHD and offers practical steps for supporting their nutrition and well-being.
In this conversation, Sarah and Eva discuss the intersection of ADHD and eating disorders. They provide practical tips for managing meal planning and preparation, including setting up emergency meal ideas and incorporating prepackaged foods. They emphasize the importance of understanding the unique challenges and needs of individuals with ADHD and eating disorders. They also discuss the benefits of seeking support and the role of diagnosis in understanding and addressing these issues.
Takeaways
ADHD can impact appetite and eating patterns, making it important to be mindful of nourishing the body consistently.
Medication for ADHD may suppress appetite, requiring strategies such as eating before taking medication or finding alternative ways to nourish the body.
Individuals with ADHD may struggle with impulse control, which can contribute to binge eating and purging behaviors.
Sensory sensitivities and executive dysfunction are common in individuals with ADHD and can impact their relationship with food and eating.
Practical steps for nourishment include eating something in the morning, identifying go-to meals, and anticipating the body's needs throughout the day. Set up emergency meal ideas to ensure satisfying and easy options are always available.
Incorporate prepackaged foods as a convenient and helpful option for meal planning.
Understand the intersection of ADHD and eating disorders to better address challenges and develop effective strategies.
Thanks for listening to Reclaim You with Reclaim Therapy!
To learn more about Reclaim Therapy and how to work with a therapist on the team, head to www.reclaimtherapy.org.
Be sure to comment, like and subscribe here, or on YouTube and come follow along on Instagram!
-
[00:01] Sarah: Hi there. Welcome to reclaim you, a podcast published by the Reclaim therapy team. Join us as we share stories, tools, and insights on how to reclaim you in the wake of trauma, disordered eating, and body shame. Grab your coffee, tea, or your favorite snack and get cozy because we're about to dive in. Hey, everyone. I'm so excited to have Eva Haldis on the podcast today. Eva is the owner and founder Reclaimed Nutrition, a nutrition group that specializes in the treatment of eating disorders and disordered eating. Once she started working with folks with eating disorders, Eva noticed the high incidence of ADHD diagnoses among her clients. As she began to increase her expertise in working with these folks, she herself was diagnosed with ADHD, which only increased her interest further. She combines her lived experience to help validate the challenges that come along eating disorder recovery while managing ADHD. So excited for you to listen to this conversation. Let's dive in. Hey, everybody. Welcome back to reclaim you. Eva's here. So glad to have Eva here.
[01:03] Eva: Hi, everyone. I'm so excited to be here on the Reclaim you podcast. Thanks for having me.
[01:08] Sarah: Yeah, of course. So, to start, I've been asking folks, what does reclaim you mean to you?
[01:14] Eva: Reclaim you. So, in the context of, I think the episode, what we're going to talk about today with ADHD rings very true for me since learning that I are maybe finally getting a diagnosis of ADHD is to really sort of learn and understand the parts of who we are non judgmentally, with compassion and curiosity and embracing those parts so that you can really live your authentic life. That's what I would say reclaiming you means to me.
[01:44] Sarah: I love that. Talk to us a little bit about maybe your journey with ADHD and your process of reclaiming you through your diagnosis and how affirming that was for you. I mean, I know the insiders of you, but, yeah, share a little bit about that.
[01:56] Eva: Yeah, you know the details because you were probably with me throughout the whole process. Yeah. My journey with ADHD, I feel like I've always suspected that I had it. It was sort of a joke with my mom growing up. I would be unable to sit still, fidgeting a lot. She would even say, it's like you have ADHD, but you don't because you do well in school and you have selective attention. You can pay attention to some stuff, but not other stuff. And so really, I think this misconception of what ADHD is or how it presents, especially in female identifying folks. And so for me, my whole life, it's just kind of been this thing that I just don't really pay attention well, in school, I kind of just figure it out. Procrastinator. I'm messy, I'm disorganized. I get really hyper fixated on stuff, and then I lose interest. All these sort of things were just kind of parts of who I was, probably parts that I felt negative towards, but it really didn't really impact my life significantly, I would say, until I had my son. And all of a sudden, all the time that I had just completely went away.
[03:01] Sarah: Evaporated?
[03:02] Eva: Yeah, pretty much. Pretty much. So before whether it was for school, even for my previous positions and my previous jobs, I had even before my private practice, I would just have all the time. So if I had a project or something that was due when it came time to get it actually done, I would be able to do it. And so when suddenly all that time was taken away and I would have sort of only 15 hours a week to work on the practice or whatever the things might be, I was finding, oh, my God, this is actually so much harder than I ever realized it was. And also, I think just from parenting and my husband and I sort of learning different ways that we are as individuals and how that sort of all of a sudden came to the surface as we became parents and the things that sort of, I would say, triggered us about one another or how we sort of processed information or remembered things or how we had conversations around things, it became sort of clear that there was a big difference between how my husband and I sort of perceived things and understood things in the context of maybe our relationship, our home, whatever it may be. And I think just like many of us, we probably all saw surge online around Covid of content, around, you might have ADHD, if whatever it might be. And obviously, that's not like a clinical way of being like, this is definitely me. But I was finding, oh, I have so many of these things. It was affirming. It was always like, oh, that's me, that's me. And actually the thing that kind of pushed me to getting diagnosed was my husband actually were doing couples counseling. And one of my big things that I've always been working on in therapy over the years of my life has been around people pleasing, fear of rejection, fear of people being mad at me. And our couple of therapists asked me, have you ever heard of this idea of rejection sensitive dysphoria? And I had sort of seen it online and was like, is this just one of those weird things that I was being a little judgmental about it, honestly, but also like, oh, this idea of, the idea of a perceived, either real or perceived rejection can be very dysregulating for somebody with ADHD would also really explain why a lot of times over my life, all these different therapies and treatments I've done haven't really super helped me sort of get over, quote unquote, or know how to manage my people pleasing parts. So I was like, okay, maybe it would just help to find out once and for all, do I meet criteria for an ADHD diagnosis? What is it? And Shocker, I did and did get diagnosed. And my psychiatrist, actually, who specializes in working with adult ADHD, really helped me understand it from a different perspective, a different lens of ADHD being a regulation disorder. And where this really was fascinating for me as an eating disorder dietitian is that I was seeing over the years, so many of my clients also have an ADHD diagnosis, and then doing some research on it and finding that actually folks with ADHD have higher likelihood of also developing an eating disorder, that it all sort of fit and started to make sense to me. Right. This sort of executive dysfunction challenges impulsivity, other regulation disorders, whether it's like emotional regulation, it would make a lot of sense why something like an eating disorder could develop with that. And so masking. Right. And so it all sort of just came together. And once I got diagnosed and got treatment, it just kind of was like all of a sudden, everything opened up to me and made so much more sense over my life of the things that were always sort of a struggle for me. Kind of clicked in and being like, oh, that's why that was that way. And it's not that I do have selective attention, but that's actually what happens with ADHD. It's not just like you can't pay attention to anything. Sometimes you can really pay attention a little bit, almost in a hyper focused way where you don't move from your seat. I have, like, knee pains. And I think part of it is that sometimes when I sit, when I get hyper focused, I don't move. And so my knees just say, like, locked in. And so anyways, that is a long, roundabout way of kind of my journey with ADHD. And once I started to learn about it for myself and understanding it from this lens of being a regulation disorder, it also really shifted in how I understood my clients with ADHD and the recommendations and sort of the ways I would help guide my clients with ADHD around managing their eating disorder recovery as well.
[07:25] Sarah: Yeah, I think that it can be so affirming I mean, first of all, looking at social media and the way the blessing and the curse of social media, always being able to see people post things that are really affirming and that you can resonate with and be like, oh, right. This actually makes a lot of sense in the context of my life. So that's really cool that you ended up there and feeling like you could expand your worldview to understand yourself more deeply and the folks that you're working with more deeply. But tell us a little bit about, I know you have some stats about eating disorders and ADHD. Talk to us a little bit about that, about that intersection of what you've seen and your experience of working with clients and also your experience as a dietitian in the world, too.
[08:08] Eva: Yeah. And I think on just what you were saying about social media, I think it can be so affirming. And also there can be the same exact thing you'll see as like, you could be this thing and have these things. And I think really talking to somebody who really understands it can be really helpful to sort of, at least for me, it was of saying, okay, is this really a thing? I sort of somehow almost like gaslighting myself into believing that it's not and really sort of getting the information that's going to be helpful for you. And kind of on the second part of what you were saying around the statistics and sort of the incidence rates and there's a lot of, I think it's one of those topics that's kind of being researched more. I think that's also why we're seeing a lot more. Sometimes it feels like, oh, now everybody has ADHD, right. And so it's like, well, the same thing with, there's a diagnosis called arfid, which is avoidant restrictive food intake disorder, which used to be just categorized as extreme picky eating. So it's kind of like the chicken or the egg, is it that it's just better understood now the diagnosis criteria has changed? Or are we just more aware of why these things are happening? Or are there other explanations?
[09:14] Sarah: Is there less stigma around it because it's being spoken about, more nuanced?
[09:18] Eva: Exactly right. And I think a big part of it. Right. Is that a lot of the research previously, and just like with most things, right, are on males, white males. And so it sort of limits. We don't fit into that. I didn't fit into those categories. I did have some hyperactivity as far as, like, fidgeting constantly growing up, but maybe I didn't really have some of the other characteristics that I think people tend to associate with ADHD. So women, in particular, female identifying folks, really tend to be overlooked as far as diagnosis goes. So I think what that will unfortunately then also do is limit maybe some of the research, but I think it's becoming something that's a little bit more studied. But from what I've seen so far is that there is some research to indicate that there can be a higher likelihood of somebody who has ADHD also developing an eat disorder versus somebody who might not. So I think one study I saw was that young girls with ADHD are four times more likely to develop an eating disorder first than girls who aren't. There was one study that was like, 11% of women with ADHD are likely to develop bulimia versus 1% without. Right. And so there's other research that shows the incidence of binge eating is also very common in folks with ADHD. I think there's a lot of reasons for why that might be, and that's what we can talk about today. But it was showing up to me and my clients. I was just like, oh, this person has ADHD diagnosis. And before I really understood it, it just kind of was like, okay, this is like a diagnosis they have. Maybe they're on a medication. I asked them, hey, does your medication affect your appetite? And they're like, that's fine. And that's all I really would do with it. But now that I sort of understand it, it actually impacts the entire way that I would probably counsel and work with a client who has ADHD, because it really is going to shift. The same things that we maybe might recommend for a client without ADHD isn't maybe necessarily going to work for our clients with ADHD. Yeah.
[11:13] Sarah: And it's so interesting to think about the prevalence of eating disorders, especially in folks who identify as female. That's primarily who listens to this podcast. But interesting to look at that and having it be such a misunderstood diagnosis, especially for young girls in the world, and the trauma that can result from that, of being misunderstood or not, kind of like fitting in and belonging and things like that, and how trauma and neurodivergence can really go hand in hand, and then even just that reemergence of not masking anymore how hard that can be to recalibrate in the world in a way. In a way that's authentically you.
[11:51] Eva: Absolutely, yeah. I mean, I was just listening to a podcast about kids and big feelings with kids who are with neurodivergence. And it really had me thinking a lot about how probably especially when it's not that typical, like, what you see of disruptive, interrupting class, hyperactive, bouncing off the walls, like, image that I think a lot of people have around ADHD, how that can really just get overlooked as, like, somebody's just acting out or why are they so they can't regulate their feelings. And it's like, oh, my God, they're always whining and ways that we can really almost sort of criticize kids for just having a really hard time because maybe they're not fitting into the mold of, like, why can't I focus the same way? I mean, I just really recently, since this is probably my first big training that I did during my. After my diagnosis, I was doing an all day training, and it was actually on internal family systems, so we were talking about parts and things like that. During this training, the whole first morning of it, I was, like, noticing other participants engaging in questions and the normal dialogue I have in my head around they can just pay attention enough that they can ask these questions and almost sort of being a little judgy about it, right. And because I was doing this training, I'm like, what's coming up for me? I was like, oh, my gosh. All my life. And I never really understood it in the context of this has just been really. It's really hard for me to pay attention in these settings. And what ended up happening was I became either critical about myself or critical of others. Just this sort of critical, know a shame cycle, really, because I'm like, why can't they do that? I can't do, like, I'm, like, in my own world, I'm just, like, thinking, all right, Eva, you got to focus. Focus on what they're saying. What did she just say? I'm, like, repeating. I'm really talking coaching myself to try to focus so hard. And actually, when I explore that with my partner that we had to do kind of like a one on one, I was able to sort of bring myself, actually helped me regulate myself enough that I was able to sort of shift to being able to focus a little bit more. So it was really interesting to me once I was able to sort of this coming back to reclaim you, come back to like, oh, I'm having this response because probably my whole life, it's been like, what's wrong with, why are you not getting good grades? I would get in trouble a lot for when I would do poorly in school versus what's going on. Why is this hard? What's the struggle versus something's wrong with what I'm doing. Right. And so it can really develop.
[14:19] Sarah: Try harder.
[14:20] Eva: Right, exactly.
[14:21] Sarah: Try harder.
[14:21] Eva: So I think a lot of things of what you're saying around trauma and just other experiences can really, I mean, really can line folks up to struggle in other ways to sort of cope with some other underlying. Yeah.
[14:33] Sarah: If there's like this inherent dysregulation from the ADHD. Right. And then you pile dysregulation from trauma or emotional overwhelm on top of it feels like a recipe for trying to cope in ways that feel effective but might be destructive in the long run.
[14:50] Eva: Such as eating disorders.
[14:51] Sarah: And I'm interested in kind of your thoughts on medication with ADHD because we know that they suppress appetite for the most part.
[15:01] Eva: Right.
[15:01] Sarah: The most common ones suppress appetite. So talk about that a little bit, if you can, about that impact on folks with disordered eating or just generally speaking, even feels important to be aware of the nuances of that.
[15:14] Eva: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it really is something we have to be cautious around with, working with folks with eating disorders, raw medications that tend to suppress folks appetize, which is a common one. Now, there are medications that don't, but maybe sometimes it might not be effective for the person as far as managing their ADHD. And so how are we sort of help? Because it's sort of like the dysregulation of the ADHD might make the eat sorter worse, but eat sorter also can kind of mix a lot of the symptoms of ADHD, like not eating enough, not having energy, not able to focus. So they can really impact one another significantly. Emotional regulation, I mean, they go hand in hand. And so I think it can be a really important tool, but we have to be just mindful of it. And I think one of the most important things that we can do, at least from the dietitian's perspective, when we have clients with ADHD who are on medication, is assessing their eating patterns around this. And so that might mean making sure that they're eating something before they take their medication, because that can really help limit some of those impacts of the appetite suppressant. Working on compassion for if their appetite is suppressed during the day and maybe they're finding themselves binging later at night, finding ways how we can notice that that's going to happen and how do we sort of work with that? Right. So if it really feels hard to eat, and this is not to collude with the eating disorder and say, but we sometimes can't give the blanket okay, you have to eat breakfast, lunch, and dinner when the person's like, I literally feel like I'm going to vomit if I eat breakfast because my medication. Right. But I need this medication to help me function. Okay, can we get something in, like a shake, something you can drink, something that feels like you can get down to give you some nourishment, which will help with all the other things, energy, focus, tension. And that also will help your body sort of say, okay, just ate. It sort of, like, revs up our body system to be like, okay, let's keep it consistent versus just not eating all day. It's sort of going to intensify that feeling. And then later we sort of crash and are like, give me all the food. And that's where sometimes binging can happen. So all that to say is that we just have to be sort of mindful of, okay, can we eat something before medication? How are we feeling about maybe the impacts of our hunger coming in full force later on in the day? How can we kind of greet that with more of neutrality or compassion or understanding of, like, maybe I just do eat more in the second half of my day and that works for me. Yeah. I think this is really where sometimes intuitive eating gets misconstrued as, like, we only can eat when we're hungry and we only got to stop when we're, and we have to stop when we're full. But I always say to clients, it's really about anticipating our body's needs. And so if we sort of know, okay, for example, I always compare this with water, right? Like, I know if I don't drink water throughout the day, I am going to have a headache, I'm going to take Advil, and then my reflux is going to go get more intense. The more I take Advil, the more it sort of irritates my reflux. I also don't want to have a headache that feels, gives me a big, not great migraines anyways. So how do we sort of set ourselves up so that I can make sure that I'm drinking enough water? I know I like cold water, so I always have ice at all times. I have a big yeti next to me. Almost always I bring it with me everywhere. It really just helps remind me to drink water because, yes, I can go all day without drinking water, take Advil, feel better with my headache, but then I'm, like, drinking more during the second half of my day, and then I'm up all night because I have to pee throughout the night, right? Or whatever. So it's sort of like that. What parts do we want? Do I want to do that? Not necessarily. It feels better when I drink throughout the day. I think we can look at it with food in a similar capacity of like, it works for me that maybe I'll eat something small earlier in my day and then I kind of eat more of my intake throughout the second half of my day. But maybe I don't like that feeling. Maybe I don't like it being 10:00 at night and all of a sudden my stomach's growling and I have to go downstairs and get a snack. And I wish I could just not. I could just go to sleep. Right. So we sort of have to sort of anticipate to pay. Okay. What is our body going to need? Because folks with ADHD also may not connect to our hunger and fullness cues the same way as folks without, especially when medication is part of the equation. So I know that kind of went around the medication piece, but also just some of the impacts of identifying can we have consistent nourishment throughout the day? And if not, how can we still get enough nourishment at some point throughout the day, whether it's later on, earlier on? Yeah.
[19:38] Sarah: And it feels so important to normalize that process, too, of like, if your hunger cues are blunted from the medication or just from hyper focusing. This happens to me all the time. I start working and I go and I don't stop until I'm like, oh, my God, I'm ravenous. Right. So in some ways, I have to prepare myself. My desk is full with a million different drinks.
[20:01] Eva: Right.
[20:01] Sarah: But also snacks and something prepared to eat so that there's something available to me. And I don't just plow through the day without noticing anything else that's going on around me or even internally.
[20:12] Eva: Totally.
[20:13] Sarah: And this set up for success in a way. And that can be intuitive eating.
[20:17] Eva: Right?
[20:17] Sarah: Like you're intuitively predicting your needs that you need to be fed or else it's going to feel like you're going to feel hangry, you're going to feel out of control.
[20:25] Eva: Right.
[20:26] Sarah: And it's not bad. It's not anything. It just is what it is. And just knowing that that's a result, physiologically of not eating all day, which enforces a restricted cycle. Right. Like, it gets so messy so quickly, especially then adding a medication that could blend your hunger on top of it.
[20:42] Eva: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, same way. Right. Like you were saying, I often on the days that I know I'll be in back to back meetings, I anticipate my body's needs by knowing by Lily pack a lunch. I don't have time to go downstairs or my son is downstairs with a caretaker and if I go downstairs, I'll be delayed 15 minutes. So I'll lily pack a lunch so that I have something. And it's usually stuff that I can sort of, I know that I'll eat that I can sort of stomach if my appetite is a little bit off from my medications. So, yeah, really having to, a lot of it is just really getting to know ourselves and what is going to work for us individually because, yeah, that's the hardest part, I think, with eating disorders and ADHD is how they sort of impact each other and make the other parts worse. Right. So if we already have this baseline ADHD, emotional regulation, impulsivity, hyper fixation, or the opposite, right, where we have complete disinterest, all these things, right, inattention, focus, fatigue. Okay, right. We have those underlying. And then that also makes eating harder or maybe has led to an eat sort diagnosis. Not eating enough throughout the day is going to impact all those things tenfold. Right? Like if you're not eating enough, you can't focus, you can't pay attention, you're going to feel that hangry feeling even more. And so you're already at a baseline, like having a hard time with regulation. Now we're adding this undernourishment. It can feel really challenging then to sort of break those patterns. And we haven't really talked about executive dysfunction. Right. But that frozen moment where you're like, I'm so hungry and I don't want to make anything, I don't want to eat anything, I don't want to make anything, I don't want to put anything together. I can't even think about it. Right. So that's really when we can use. I'll find, okay, the times in the morning when maybe my appetite isn't at its peak is not the time I'm going to be like, prepping what I'm going to make for dinner that week, right. Because nothing's going to sound enticing, but at night when my medication is sort of worn off and I'm hungry, I'm like, oh, what should I cook for dinner this week? That's really a good time for me to plan my meals so that it works for me as far as knowing things that I'm going to enjoy. So how do we find that for those, for folks who are why I never want to eat anything. Okay, so what do we have any pockets of time we can identify? What are three meals that I know I can always easily put together that is quick, easy, nourishing, satisfying.
[23:08] Sarah: Yeah, that's going to be enough, right? Like, maybe it's not the most satisfying in the entire world, but is it satisfying enough?
[23:14] Eva: Right?
[23:15] Sarah: Will it just get you through? And that can be okay?
[23:17] Eva: It can be okay. Totally. Doesn't have to be perfect. Instagram worthy meals have all the things that are colorful, right? Sometimes it's just cup noodle ramen and hard boiled eggs and whatever fruit is left over from my son's breakfast, for lunch, or for a snack, whatever it might be. And that's really where we can help our clients identify what they're going to need, but from a structured place that can sort of help guide them into saying, okay, this actually does feel satisfied. My energy does feel better. I actually feel more tolerant of my coworkers or my partner. I'm not as annoyed at everybody because I'm actually not so hangry that I'm not realizing that it's actually both of those things, the ADHD and the not eating enough. Yeah.
[24:07] Sarah: And this bid for tending to your just basic needs, right? Whether that's eating a snack or peeing and not just like, holding your bladder for an hour because you're hyper fixated on something. I think we've all been there. But this bid for understanding and feeling and responding for anyone, but especially folks who have a harder time with these interceptive cues to feel it and to respond, because you really just inherently deserve that. It's a really great place to start.
[24:41] Eva: And I think the other part of where we sometimes see this and where it can really be common is through more impulse control, kind of, I would say, like ink store behavior, such as bulimia, sometimes binging as well. Although I would say a lot of folks feel like, okay, binging is sort of like stress eating, emotional eating, dopamine seeking. And it's not to say that it's not. But typically, I would say for most people, I don't see that unless they're also not eating enough throughout the day. Right. And so it's like a yes. And both things can be true, but if we're eating more throughout the day, we're less likely to then also have those same urges to binge later or have these sort of more impulse control issues with food, which also is okay. I don't want to say there's anything wrong with. I know Sarah and I both take this approach as far as with binging, it's like we're not trying to make our clients stop binging. Unless of course they're like, I hate how this feels. I feel so impulsive, or all these things. We'll probably work more with them, run those feelings around, binging. But the goal is not to really stop you from binging because binging is probably the thing that it's probably a protective way of your body telling you you're not getting enough food throughout the day.
[25:52] Sarah: Like probably just like saving your ***, right?
[25:54] Eva: Actually. And sometimes, though, it is, sometimes it is emotional, sometimes it is like dopamine taking. I mean, I really remember when my son was little and just sort of like eating some sweet stuff and I'm tend to be a savory person and just being like, I think this is just what I'm needing right now. I just need this sweetness right now. Right? So it's not saying that it's not going to happen. Of course it does. But I would check in just from a compassionate and curious place. Am I actually eating throughout the day before this binge happens, or am I having like a protein bar in the morning and then binging later? It would make a lot of sense that would happen. And then around folks who have any kind of purging in bulimia that really, I think, highlights why there's a much higher incidence of folks with ADHD. Right. Impulse control is a big factor in folks with ADHD coming back to regulation challenges. Purging can really provide an instant regulation. So it's sort of how I find clients sometimes will regulate that discomfort, whether it's from fullness and what that might mean for them or from the binge. Right. Sort of. How do I sort of get this discomfort? I can't regulate how intense this feels right now. And purging can really provide that. Plus impulsive pulsiveness. All these things are going to lead to that being harder to sort of regulate in the moment. And so I think it can be really hard for clients with ADHD to use maybe tips and tricks that we've used with other clients, like setting timers or reminders even for eating throughout the day. Right? Yeah. Those are sometimes going to be more challenging for clients with ADHD because it's just as easy for us to say, like, never mind, I don't want to.
[27:33] Sarah: Go off like ten times, I'm in.
[27:34] Eva: The middle of this. I can't get up. I'm in the middle of a project. I can't get up and possibly go get a snack. Right.
[27:42] Sarah: Because I'll never be able to focus again.
[27:44] Eva: Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
[27:45] Sarah: It's interesting because what kind of sparked my interest with ADHD is my son has had some challenges, and he recently got diagnosed with ADHD. I've kind of looked at it through the lens of him because he has very typical boy type of behaviors. Right. He also has other neurodivergents kind of on board. But it's just been interesting to look at that regulation factor and how it shows up, even with his sensory sensitivities.
[28:13] Eva: Right.
[28:13] Sarah: And I think that's something, too, that can be spoken about for adults. There's a lot of sensory stuff that can come up that's just kind of dismissed and diminished and just like, again, get over it. So it's interesting to see it kind of like playing out in my own personal life with witnessing him and supporting him and learning how to feel into his body and understand his needs and communicate and all of those life skills. And also, I don't know, the open forum in a way of this being more discussed and more research and more ability to get a diagnosis and get treatment and all that. Really important to have these conversations and for people to know that to have an ADHD diagnosis and an eating disorder diagnosis, it's workable still. It's not hopeless. You can still engage in your recovery.
[29:05] Eva: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I have a client who I've worked with for, for a long time around their eating disorder, and one of the things that I noticed when I started actually understanding and learning about ADHD more was an example that they would often give is like, okay, I'm going to go to the store. I'm going to get the stuff. And then I would see them next week. And same goal. I'm going to go to the store and get the stuff. And I was like, I'm curious. After you get the stuff, you go to the store, you get the stuff. We don't get to the next part, which is eat the stuff. Right. It just lives in the fridge or the pantry forever. Does it feel like it's off the to do list? And she was like, yeah, actually it does. That was the thing. Like, oh, I have to just do this thing. Okay. And then it's forgotten. It's like, that was a focus that's off. Right. So actually adding in this other component of the, which sounds so right, like, maybe for someone who's neurotypical, that makes, like, total. Why wouldn't they just eat the food? That's the whole point. Right. But it's like her. And also all the other layers of things that we've talked about, right. People pleasing, rejection sensitive tea. Oh, yeah. That was what I need to do is go to the store and get the stuff. And now I'm done with that and I can just focus on the next thing and forget about it. Or now we're sort of working on how can they find foods that are actually be satisfying for them? And this sort of fear of, like, I'm not going to do it well, I'm not doing it perfectly. And a lot of the parts that come up for her around that is being told she was lazy growing up. She's not trying hard enough. Why can't she just do it right? And it really freezes her from being able to just do it right. I always say, yes, I can tell you. I can help guide you in what to eat or maybe what foods to put together to make a more nourishing and satisfying meal. But usually by that point that somebody's gone through any sort of treatment, they sort of know there's just something that's sort of like, keeping them from it. And sometimes maybe that self judgment of, like, I'm not doing it perfectly. We see perfectionism a ton in eating disorder work.
[30:57] Sarah: Oh, yeah.
[30:58] Eva: And also that's a big overlap with ADHD, especially with women and girls, because once again, we're told you're just not trying hard enough, you're just lazy. If we just did better, if you just tried, you would do better. And so there becomes this thing of like, okay, well, then I can only do it when it's the best.
[31:14] Sarah: Right? And the praise that you get when you do it really well, when you get the good grades, it's like you're burning yourself down to achieve this standard. And then when it feels like too much to get there, then it's like everything falls away.
[31:26] Eva: Yeah, you're totally burned out from it, and you're like, okay, now I can't do it. And that's where that executive dysfunction can really come up, too. And that's really where it's helpful as far as identifying for folks with ADHD, how do we sort of still nourish my body when I am in that place where I can't even think about cooking something right? Or the whole step of it feels daunting, right? Because think about it right? If you have this whole perfectionist part or all these other things of like, I got to do this right, or I can only eat the thing that I'm craving, or all these kind of beliefs around it, how overwhelming it might be to walk into a store and be like, what am I supposed to buy? Right? And so sometimes what I'll help my clients with is, like, identifying foods that we definitely like and having them in the freezer. Precut veggies, precut fruits, precut things, right? Like components that are just easy to throw together and having all those ready to go so that we can just sort of cut the steps. Because I think even just for someone with an eating disorder, I always say it's a lot of work to go figure out what you want to eat, decide how you're going to make it, put it together, and then actually eat it. Right. Can we just say, like, one, two. The first step is like, here's the thing, and I'm going to eat it. Right?
[32:34] Sarah: So give us, if you could, three just tangible, practical steps for folks who are diagnosed with ADHD or maybe even think they have ADHD and haven't had a diagnosis that will support them in feeding themselves, that will support their nutrition.
[32:50] Eva: That's a great one. So I think number one, and these are probably all things I've sort of mentioned today, is eating, if you can, something in the morning, whether that's like a smoothie, drinking something, having something, especially if you take medication, just because that will just make it easier to eat later. It'll sort of, sort of gives your body the message of like, oh, we're awake. Right. So I usually say to people, it's kind of like we're driving with an empty tank of gas. We sort of want to fill up the tank a little bit before we start the day and get us kind of going. And that'll just help. That'll help your hunger cues be a little bit stronger. It'll help sort of get your body being like, okay, this is what it's like to be nourished and fed. And it does help with medication, kind of that appetite suppressant piece. So it doesn't have to be like a perfect breakfast, but I would say try to do a little bit of something. So that's number one. So the second thing I would say is, I always like to set up these sort of emergency meal ideas with my clients of sort of like, what are the things that I can always eat? And it feels satisfying enough, right. And that may change for people's ADHD because we also tend to get really hyper fixations. And so something might be like, this is the only thing I want to eat for the entire week, and then I'm never going to look at this again for like three months. And so that may change week to week, month to month. But I think having sort of a consistent, okay, what can I always sort of eat? What do I always have? Right? So for us in my house, we always have tortillas. We almost always have frozen chicken nuggets at some point for my son especially. And we also always have Caesar dressing because my son randomly loves Caesar salads. So that's something that I can quickly make. Microwave some chicken, throw it on a tortilla with some salad dressing and some romaine lettuce. And there we go. I've got a Caesar wrap, right? So that I know is always going to be satisfying and good for me. Right? So right now, and maybe in a couple of months it won't be. So really identify what are some of those easy options? So we want to just sort of take the steps away from sort of getting in our own way of, I can't decide anything to eat, so I'm not going to eat anything. Right? What are those ideas for dinner? Maybe it's like, I know I can always eat pizza, right? So that means we're either going to get pizza or I'm going to always have a frozen pizza in my freezer. Which brings me to my next number three, which I think kind of tied into number two, in some ways around the amazingness around prepackaged foods. If you're a client of ours in our practice, you probably have heard us talking about Trader Joe's. We actually have a blog post coming out on our website soon around five Trader Joe's friendly eating disorder meals. Because we're working on that, because a lot of this overlaps, obviously with people with eating disorders, not just for folks with ADHD or not just people who have one or the other. It can really work for both populations, but ways that we can take things that are pre made. And Trader Joe's does a really great job of this. They just have really great pieces of meals, right? Like a tv dinner is usually not enough food. Which is why we love Trader Joe's is because they have so many different components in the freezer section. They have a lot of prepackaged foods, like precut stuff. What steps can we take? Right? Does that mean we just buy precut onions? Precut onions, carrots and celery and just throw that in? Right. Trader Joe's has these great garlic frozen garlic cubes. Because for me, right, like talk about all the sensory steps. I like fresh garlic and stuff. It tastes better in some dishes, but to take out the garlic, chop it up. I don't like how it smells on my fingers forever, so then I feel like I have to. There's like a hack that you can wash it and rub your fingers on stainless steel anyways, all that, right. The smell of garlic on my hands later makes quick hacks to your meals to just make the process easier can be really helpful, right. To just kind of cut the corners where you can. And we are very fortunate to have so many great options like that now in stores. Absolutely. What do you think? Is there anything you would adD?
[36:42] Sarah: Yeah, I think just that curiosity of when these two things are colliding. Right. Disordered eating or an eating disorder and adhd or neurodivergence. Just generally speaking, just staying really curious around respecting what's kind of like organic and there and always has been and what your eating disorder. Disordered eating is kind of like capitalizing on in a way, whether that's like, no, you can't have prepackaged foods because I should be able to just get my **** together and chop the onion and do the garlic and whatever. Or prepackaged food is bad because it has chemicals or whatever. The narrative is just being really curious about where one starts and where one ends, how they kind of collide together and what that's doing to your system. Right. Just being really curious about that and working with folks who get it and can really help you parse through it all and just kind of untangle the ball of, I don't know, stuff that all of this can turn into.
[37:41] Eva: Yeah, that's such a great point. Right? Because there can be some food rules that develop over the time of the eating disorder. Disordered eating development. That's an eating disorder part, but also it's inhibiting your ability to sort of nourish yourself, which also may be an extra challenge if you have ADHD. Right. Or can even, I think. I think for me too, even just like understanding ourselves, I think that's really what's so helpful about getting a diagnosis, right. And I think there's probably a lot. I think you could probably do a whole other podcast on this. Is diagnosis required? Do you need it? For me, it was really helpful to say, oh, that makes so much more sense now, versus maybe the lens that I had kind of on some of the other things in my life previously, to say, okay, this is like an ADHD thing that I've always kind of done. I'm more likely to hyper sit down and not get up and eat something and then feel, have a headache. Later because of that. I don't want that because then my whole day is going to be ruined. Right. How do we sort of understand ourselves from a curious, compassionate place and then we can kind of figure out, okay, what parts of this is my eating disorder? Is it the, like, oh, I'm scared to eat processed foods because XYz of diet culture. Okay, what will that do by letting go of that? That will help me in these other ways. Right?
[38:59] Sarah: Totally. Well, thank you so much for coming on and talking about your experience and how you work with folks and some really just important tips, I think, for I know the clients and both of our practices to take home and consider.
[39:14] Eva: Thank you. Yeah, absolutely. Thanks for having me. I hope this was helpful and made sense.
[39:19] Sarah: Yeah.
[39:20] Eva: The way that I tell stories, because of ADHD, I tend to go all over the place. I'm always like, those are my critical parts that are coming up. But, yeah, it can really shape sort of different recommendations that we would make. And so if it feels like maybe the eating sort of treatment I've been getting just isn't sort of getting something, they're maybe like pushing me to do something and it just feels like I can't do it, but it's sort of not my eating disorder that's like limiting it. Is it this other piece, having somebody that maybe understands this adhd component to it could be really helpful to say, okay, that's actually probably part of it as well. So thank you for having me and being able to talk about this.
[39:55] Sarah: And when the blog goes out on the website, let me know so I can link here about Trader Joe's and all of their delicious options. I wish I had a Trader Joe's closer to my house, but that's okay.
[40:04] Eva: There's office if you don't have a Trader Joe's near you, there's a lot of great options, even at, quote unquote, normal grocery stores nowadays. But we love ourselves.
[40:13] Sarah: Trader Joe's on our team and just let everyone know where they can find you.
[40:18] Eva: So our practice is reclaimed nutrition. Our website is ww, reclaimnnutritionpa.com. Our instagram is at reclaimnutrition underscore, Pa. I think that's the big two. If this feels like this was resonating for you and reach out for some.
[40:36] Sarah: Support, well, I'll link to everything and thank you again and we will be back next week, everybody. Until then, take good care. Thank you so much for joining us on this episode of Reclaim. You be sure to, like, comment and subscribe and check us out on YouTube at reclaim you. If you're looking to start therapy for trauma, disordered eating or body image concerns, head over to our website at ww reclaimtherapy.org to learn more about us and our work. We'll be back next week with another episode. Until then, take good care of yourself.
Reclaim therapy is a group of Eating Disorder Therapists in Pennsylvania, EMDR therapist in Horsham, PA , Trauma Therapists and grief counselors in Pennsylvania.
We also provide therapy for Complex PTSD, in Horsham, PA, therapy for binge eating disorder, and body image counseling in Horsham, PA.
We’re passionate about helping people reclaim their lives from the impact of trauma, diet culture and body shame.
We would love to support you as you Reclaim YOU and the life that you undeniably deserve.